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Great Pyrenees => Great Pyrenees Discussions => : Ursa August 20, 2008, 06:37:56 PM

: Can you stand yet another question?
: Ursa August 20, 2008, 06:37:56 PM
It's only been a week and a half and we're doing pretty well.  The leash walking gets better every day and housebreaking is more or less on schedule but we are really struggling with crating.  We've had plenty of large dogs before and while none of them loved the crate, they'd all go in without too much of a fuss.  The difference is that they were all adult dogs when we brought them home. 

Ursa will try to hide when it's crate time (not easy when you're a 35 pound ball of white fluff).  She has to be made to go in and you practically have to slam the door on her to prevent escape.  Once she's crated, she barks like crazy for a good 10-15 minutes.  She's never tried to break out - that's a plus.  (We did have a foster dog once who managed to completely destroy a large crate.)

Again, I realize that she hasn't been with us long but I can't help but feel that we aren't getting off on the right foot here.  Any advice on crate training a GP puppy? 
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: faye August 20, 2008, 07:13:59 PM
I could use it too.  have one pyr who couldnt care less if she is crated and one who goes nuts when crated.  but when she was crated at the vets she was fine.  go figure!!
I feed them in the crates and one runs in and waits. the other will only put the front paws in to eat.  refuses to go in all the way no matter what. 
and they are sisters we have raised since they were 6 wks old. loved the crate when young.
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: People Whisperer August 20, 2008, 07:15:27 PM
I like to introduce crate S-L-O-W-L-Y  :) Just leave the door open and drop a bunch of treats in there. Let her chew on her kong or bully stick in the crate only with an open door and in no time she will love it  ;)
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: pyr4me August 20, 2008, 07:17:32 PM
When I crate trained Tipper treats worked wonders in getting him to go in--and then I used a kong with peanut butter to help him like being in--basically wanted him to associate his crate with good and yummy things so that he would eventually willingly go in and stay in. He wasn't a Pyr puppy, but that's what worked for us.  :)
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: Ursa August 20, 2008, 08:36:54 PM
I should have mentioned that our Ursa is the least treat motivated dog I've ever met.   :(  Should make puppy class a lot more interesting, huh? 
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: lookingfornewf August 20, 2008, 09:39:49 PM
Since she is not treat motivated is there a special toy she likes. If you got her one she really liked and gave it just at crate time it might help. Where is the crate? Clifford took much longer than my other dog to get used to the crate. He did better with it in the bedroom or living room. He liked to be close to us when he was crated for overnight. It's now in the basement because it is cooler there. He is a year old and I still have to tempt him in with Kongs and peanutbutter or his favorite (frozen meatballs), but he will go right in for them.
Clifford is extremely treat motivated, my other dog not at all. For her classes we brought squeeky toys and bell toys, she would just ignore the food.
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: patrick August 21, 2008, 06:16:11 AM
HA HA- Many Pyrs could care less about treat- makes for a real challenge in obedience training or showing.  They almost seem offended that you are offering such a paltry thing.  However there is always something that is absolutely irresistible- Kongs stuffed with cheese or peanut butter, bully sticks, a large marrow beef bone.  If you are offering things like a biscuit then you need to up the ante- this is a Pyr!
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: kathryn August 21, 2008, 07:56:31 AM
I don't have pyrs but I have had the crate training issue.  Are you using a wire crate or a plastic crate?  The reason I ask is because Kaila prefers a plastic crate that is more enclosed and cave like and her sister Cinder prefers an open wire crate.  Also, Cinder was more praise motivated than treat motivated as a puppy so there was always a giant party when she entered the crate.  Definitely, had to go slowly to make sure she was fine with it.  Hope that helps.
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: vmimom2006 August 21, 2008, 08:29:45 AM
Athena had never been crated till I got her at 9 months and she hated it. I used the peanutbutter in the kong and she only gets it when I need her to go in the crate. I would lay in the crate with her and give her a good back rub sometimes too. After about a week she would see the kong come out and run for her crate (cracks me up when she does that). I had a pry years ago and he was fairly stubborn at times so I feel you pain. Those sad eyes are real heart breakers!!
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: Ursa August 21, 2008, 12:52:05 PM
Exactly, Patrick!!  How dare I offend her diva-ness with a mere hot dog cube??? 

We have a wire crate that stays in our bedroom.  She's usually only crated when we leave for work.  She's never crated for more than a few hours - our neighbor comes over during the day to let her out for potty breaks, playtime etc. 

I've tried the peanut butter kong and she ignored it.  I tried cat treats (the forbidden fruit - thought that would entice her - hah!)but no luck.  Put her favorite blue squeaky toy in.  Nope.  Haven't tried cheese yet - that's the only treat that seems promising for puppy class so I don't want her to associate it with her arch enemy the crate.  I do have marrow bones on order from the butcher - they should be in this week so I'll try those.  I can see that I'm going to have to be more creative with this puppy than I ever was with my greyhounds!

On the upside, I just called the vet to check on how Ursa's spay went today and she's been barking nonstop in their crate ever since she woke up so it's not just at home!  Our girl just can't face life behind bars. 
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: steve August 23, 2008, 08:52:39 PM
My GP Cody basically was uncratable as a puppy. He barked all night long and as much as we tried to ignore him we gave in and let him out (after weeks of trying). He was born on a farm where his parents were guard dogs and I just think he was spoiled running free as a puppy. GP's were bred to be free and I think it's unfair to lock them up against there will. Sounds like some are more strong willed than others and Cody is definetly strong willed.
Good luck.   
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: DixieSugarBear August 24, 2008, 07:33:21 AM
You may want to give Comfort Zone a try. You can just spray a litte on the floor of the crate. I use it on my crates at dog shows and and mine take naps in the middle of the crazyness so I know it works.

http://petcomfortzone.com/comfortzone_dap.htm
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: People Whisperer August 25, 2008, 06:24:31 AM
I use it on my crates at dog shows and and mine take naps in the middle of the crazyness so I know it works.

http://petcomfortzone.com/comfortzone_dap.htm
Lisa, how are your dogs in the ring after using this spray? Are they all droopy and tired looking or just relaxed?

: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: DixieSugarBear August 29, 2008, 09:52:08 AM
I really do not see any difference in the ring.  It just makes them nice and comfy in the crate.  I spray a little on the bedding in the crate and that is it.  I even know handers that spary some on themself.

Lisa
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: lins_saving_grace August 30, 2008, 06:04:36 AM
Grace loves going to "BED".  she's so food driven that once a bone hits the air and before it hits the pillows on the floor of her crate, she is in there and chewing on her treats.  I tell her time for bed and she's there. 
Maybe I got lucky.  Maybe she's just special.  I just think crate training goes better for some dogs than others.   
Let them cry themselves to sleep when you put them in there.  the more you let them out because you feel bad for them, the more they do it.  :)  I know...it's harsh...but if you want a dog crate trained (since it is a safe place for them when you're not home) it has to be done.
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: Ursa August 30, 2008, 08:49:10 AM
Armed with all of your suggestions and some advice from the trainer from puppy class, we're going to bite the bullet and start doing some serious crate training this weekend.  I'd be lying if I said we're looking forward to the barking that's bound to ensue!!

I can't wait until she's big enough to graduate to having her own room!  So much easier and roomier than the crate.  We've got a lot of growing up and training to get through before then though.
: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: DixieSugarBear August 30, 2008, 08:59:27 AM
You know when I got Rosie and Sugar Bear I hated the idea of a crate. Now I love love love my crates. Most of the time the doors are open and they go in them to take a nap or just to rest a bit.

: Re: Can you stand yet another question?
: JoMorningstar August 31, 2008, 10:09:30 PM
What i found worked with Heather who is also not food motivated (unless its pepperoni) was to use a really happy voice (not too high pitched) and give lots of praise.. also putting in the task well done. such as *good job Heather, Good  sit*  and so on. Pyrs i have found do like to please, and the more verbal praise you give the more they enjoy it.. not to say they will do it every time you ask though.. grin ..

Heather was donated to me when she was 3.5 yrs of age. She was in Missouri, and i had just gone back to my home state to visit my mom. My service dog died the very next day, and i was in shock, however because i need medical alerts from a dog it was an immediate search for my next one. I have been training my own service dogs and helping others train theirs for golly, 30 some years now. so i was on the immediate search for my next MASD.  I went to evaluate Heather, and in  trying her out.. when i reached down to pet her for a job well done.. she winched.. she had never been touched for doing some thing GOOD.. apparently their trainer had told them not to touch her unless she was being corrected.. POOR DOG.. she soon learned that my hands on her meant she was loved. and not a correction.

so lots of praise verbal and petting.. and watch her reactions to these to see which one she likes the most.. some times i go a bit overboard, and then i get a look from Heather of embarrassment. . so i try to remember to tone it down the next time.. other times.. i get lots of waggy tail and a happy look from her.. which in turn is MY praise for a job well done..

Josephine Morningstar & Heather, Grt Pyr MASD
Native American in New England.