Training question/quandry

[zanie]

So Dell is still a very active beast dog.  He’s 18 months old and full of the old hairy ALL THE TIME.  We have been through three training classes and I want to put him into another with a trainer that I think has done good thing for Delly.

Here is the problem:  Hubby doesn’t like the trainer.  Hubby dislikes the trainer so much that he is refusing to allow me to pay for more training for the dog…AT ALL.  He feels that we’ve spent plenty of hard earned $$$ on training and he doesn’t want to “waste” any more money.  “How hard can it be to train a dog??”  The answer to that question is this: difficult enough that we had to seek out a behavioral consultant when he was a pup because he was becoming aggressive and had resource guarding issues because we were doing SO well in training him ourselves…

If we don’t get him more training, will he continue to be the dopey, wild, anarchist that we currently have?  I’m hoping that further training and age will further temper his wild-child-ness.

Opinions?

[NoDogNow]

Has hubby taken Dell to any of the training classes? 

[Gypsy Jazmine]

I'd suggest, in light of your husbands strong feelings & the fact that you've been through 3 coarses of training already, to back off on that for now...However in saying that I'd also strongly recommend you pick up some good dog literature like anything by Suzanne Clothier or "The Other End of The Leash" (can't remember who it's by) I am wondering if maybe you need to better understand why your dog does the things he does instead of just being happy or not happy he does it...My favorite trainer uses alot of Suzannes stuff & it is invaluable to me!...Good luck!

[zanie]

Yes, he took him to the first round and then to individual classes when he had the time (he's been working on his Masters and also furiously busy at work)

The problem is that there is such a personality conflict between him and the trainer.  I think if I was more willing to go to someone else, he might not fight it so hard.  I think I'll ask him that.

[zanie]

I'd also strongly recommend you pick up some good dog literature like anything by Suzanne Clothier or "The Other End of The Leash" (can't remember who it's by) I am wondering if maybe you need to better understand why your dog does the things he does instead of just being happy or not happy he does it...My favorite trainer uses alot of Suzannes stuff & it is invaluable to me!...Good luck!

Thank you for the book suggestions, Gypsy.  I'll pick them up tomorrow because I need some reinforcement.

The problem is that this trainer has really helped Dell.  She has been patient with us and with him and has worked him through his aggression and his resource guarding.  I guess my loyalty lies in the wrong spot...   I should be supporting my hubby rather than fighting against him.

[Gypsy Jazmine]

I'd also strongly recommend you pick up some good dog literature like anything by Suzanne Clothier or "The Other End of The Leash" (can't remember who it's by) I am wondering if maybe you need to better understand why your dog does the things he does instead of just being happy or not happy he does it...My favorite trainer uses alot of Suzannes stuff & it is invaluable to me!...Good luck!

Is there a difference in training technique between the trainers you've used?...If so what are they?...Why does you hubby so much oppose this trainer you've been working with & what is it about her that you feel helps you & Dell?...What is her training technique?...Why do you feel she can further help you with Dell?...I'm just asking to get a better feel for your situation. ...Regardless of what you decide for training...Pic k up the books, sit back, read & regroup...If there is anything I can help you with let me know.

Thank you for the book suggestions, Gypsy.�  I'll pick them up tomorrow because I need some reinforcement.

The problem is that this trainer has really helped Dell.�  She has been patient with us and with him and has worked him through his aggression and his resource guarding.�  I guess my loyalty lies in the wrong spot... �  I should be supporting my hubby rather than fighting against him.

What is your trainer's technique for training?...Does she teach from the dog's point of view or does she teach the by always dominating your dog?...The reason I ask is that after three rounds of training I really think she has taught you all she can...

[zanie]

She definately teaches from the dog's point of view. Her website states she uses positive, reward-based training. (www.goodcitize ncanine.com)

Here's a link to her reading list:  http://www.goodcitizencanine.com/resources.php?page=reading

Hubby does not like the trainer because she is a lesbian AND because she is a very dominant personality.  She also brings her dog to classes and Dolce can be distracting (I have issue with that as well but during the last round of classes she left her home most of the time.)

Our first round of classes was at Petsmart and I feel it was a complete joke and waste of $100.  What a huge waste of time!  The next two rounds were Puppy Kindergarten and Puppy II class.  He is definately learning in the classes and he is so darn smart.  It seems like a waste to not utilize his intelligence and get him completely trained.

What I would ultimately like to do is earn his Canine Good Citizen Certificate through the AKC.  Not sure it's possible at this point in his life as he is such a goofball.

[Gypsy Jazmine]

As far as your husbands issues with the trainers sexual orientation that is up to you two to work out but in my opinion if the trainer is good I don't think their personal life should be an issue...You are there to get help for yourself & your dog & that should be the focus on the dog training...In regards to the trainer's strong personality truthfully I'd rather deal with a strong personality when I am asking for help with my dogs because I like to know just what I need to do & not have the facts candy-coated...As far as briging her dog to class if he is a distraction that would be an issue I would have a problem with...The focus should be on the owners & dogs who came for training.
So, you've had this trainer for just one coarse of classes..right?...Do you feel she can teach you more than she already has?...Even with our trainer who hubby & I both like quite alot I think I have learned all I can from him in a classs setting but I do call him for private consultation when we feel we need guidence...Whe n it is needed he comes out to our house...Is there another trainer nearby that you & hubby can agree on?...If not I would just pick up some of the literature I mentioned & maybe check your trainers list of reccomnded reading & just be consistant & reinforce what you've already learned...Unti l Dell has that down there is really no sense in going on to a higher level of training...& at 18 months Dell is still a puppy really...He'll calm down for you as he gets older & be able to focus on his commands better...But, just like with a child, I believe the most important thing is being consistant...I bet he'll get it & calm down for you...Good luck!

[doggylover]

I don't understand why anyone would give much of a rip who the dog trainer is 'with'.  Um all I care about is that they be a good trainer.  Of course if the issue is that she is immasculating, I guess I can see him not liking that, although even there, I don't really care about the peronality as much as the professionalis m/knowledge. 
I think if you do what you did, you'll get what you got.  In other words, if Dell is acting out now, and you don't train him, he will keep acting out...only worse because he will keep pushing the boundaries. 
Maybe the two of you could compromise and find a trainer you both like. 
I would STRONGLY recommend 'Leader of the Pack' you can order it through Amazon.  It is the single best, easiest to understand book I have ever found.  Badger was a BEAST as a puppy, he was growly, snarly, aggressive, unruley, stubborn, and NASTY.  If you picked him up, he bared all his teeth and snarled at you. Now, after all his training, including hand feeding, nilf, what I learned in that book, and lots of love, he is growly, stubborn, and stinky!!!!! HUGE improvement!
    

[zanie]

As far as who the trainer is "with", it's not a big deal for him or I until she repeatedly makes reference to her partner and their relationship.  It seems like she has something to prove and wants everyone to know about it.   Whether his discomfort is right or wrong, it is what it is. 

Then there was the time she made fun of my husband for not being in touch with his feminine side, in front of the whole class. (She was talking about recall and how if you use a high pitched voice, Dell would respond better.  He couldn't make his voice as high pitched as what she thought was appropriate. He is EXTREMELY sensitive to criticism and being ridiculed.)

We talked last night and agreed to put all organized classes on hold for the summer and then investigate trainers in the fall.  During the summer we will get good training/understand your dog books and work with him at home.  If we see a difference from our efforts this summer, we will reconsider classes.

Thank you both for your time and thoughts.  I was so set on getting Delly more training that I neglected to take a more objective view.  As I said to Hubby last night, it I was the one in his shoes, I would be upset that he was forcing more training with a trainer I didn't like.

[doggylover]

As far as who the trainer is "with", it's not a big deal for him or I until she repeatedly makes reference to her partner and their relationship.�  It seems like she has something to prove and wants everyone to know about it.�  � Whether his discomfort is right or wrong, it is what it is.� 

Then there was the time she made fun of my husband for not being in touch with his feminine side, in front of the whole class. (She was talking about recall and how if you use a high pitched voice, Dell would respond better.�  He couldn't make his voice as high pitched as what she thought was appropriate. He is EXTREMELY sensitive to criticism and being ridiculed.)

We talked last night and agreed to put all organized classes on hold for the summer and then investigate trainers in the fall.�  During the summer we will get good training/understand your dog books and work with him at home.�  If we see a difference from our efforts this summer, we will reconsider classes.

Thank you both for your time and thoughts.�  I was so set on getting Delly more training that I neglected to take a more objective view.�  As I said to Hubby last night, it I was the one in his shoes, I would be upset that he was forcing more training with a trainer I didn't like.

I'm sorry, I HAD to laugh here.  After my last post, I started wondering how you knew the trainer was lesbian.  I mean, it's not really relevant to the training.  I think I must have assumed that you were guessing based on something 'about' her. 
ROFL the reason this is SO funny to me is that my hubby is SO painfully shy.  If that woman said that stuff to my husband, or even put him on the spot in a less obvious but still uncomfortable way, I KNOW he would get up and leave (as unobtrusively as possible-like he would say, I'm sorry I have to run to the bathroom and just not come back).  I can't blame your hubby at all.  And he would never allow me to take Pookie back to that trainer. 
Badger (Pookie) slept through almost the entire puppy class.  Puppy class is for the dog to be around other dogs (as distraction during training) and to teach the parent how to train the dog.  That is all a trainer really does.  They teach the owner what to do. 
You seem smart to me, I think you can train the dog without much more $ output.  I would rec that you get that one book (leader of the pack) and read everything you can find on NILF.  Also, I would recommend hand feeding.  Dogs get very submissive while waiting for YOU to give them ONE little BITE at a time of their food.  It becomes very clear to them who controls the resources (and s/he who controls the resources is the boss-funny it's the same with humans!)
If at the end of the summer you have seen no improvement, maybe you can go to another class.  One with a trainer who doesn't eat men for lunch!
 

[Gypsy Jazmine]

As far as who the trainer is "with", it's not a big deal for him or I until she repeatedly makes reference to her partner and their relationship.�  It seems like she has something to prove and wants everyone to know about it.�  � Whether his discomfort is right or wrong, it is what it is.� 

Then there was the time she made fun of my husband for not being in touch with his feminine side, in front of the whole class. (She was talking about recall and how if you use a high pitched voice, Dell would respond better.�  He couldn't make his voice as high pitched as what she thought was appropriate. He is EXTREMELY sensitive to criticism and being ridiculed.)

We talked last night and agreed to put all organized classes on hold for the summer and then investigate trainers in the fall.�  During the summer we will get good training/understand your dog books and work with him at home.�  If we see a difference from our efforts this summer, we will reconsider classes.

Thank you both for your time and thoughts.�  I was so set on getting Delly more training that I neglected to take a more objective view.�  As I said to Hubby last night, it I was the one in his shoes, I would be upset that he was forcing more training with a trainer I didn't like.

In this light I can certainly understand why your hubby has taken a dislinke to this trainer!...I don't think I would care for her either...If someone put my hubby on the spot like that I am afraid there would be chaos in class that didn't involve unruly dogs...lol!...She sounds very abrasive...Let us know how Dell does for you this summer...I am interested in his progress!

[doggylover]

Any time you say come and can't back it up...they become more convinced it is "their" decison! LOL
� 

ROFL if I'm on the couch, and I give Badger a command, sometimes, he 'sizes me up'.  Looks at me first to see if I look alive enough to get up.  I sometimes have to lean forward a half inch and give him the look and then he will quickly do the command.  Once or twice I've had to jump up and go after him.  The second after I get up, he is obeying.  What a little PILL.