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Difference between AKC and FCI standard?
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Difference between AKC and FCI standard?« on: February 11, 2007, 10:26:30 AM »
Hiho- I'm researching St. Bernards and live down in Brasil, under the FCI umbrella. I understand that the St. Bernard standard for FCI and AKC are very different but I'm not sure how. Does anyone know the basic differences? Are the temperments generally aspiring to the same standard?
Thanks in advance for any help-
Karina
Thanks in advance for any help-
Karina
Re: Difference between AKC and FCI standard?« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2007, 12:05:41 PM »
Hiho- I'm researching St. Bernards and live down in Brasil, under the FCI umbrella. I understand that the St. Bernard standard for FCI and AKC are very different but I'm not sure how. Does anyone know the basic differences? Are the temperments generally aspiring to the same standard?
Thanks in advance for any help-
Karina
Thanks in advance for any help-
Karina
Not my breed, but you can do a side by side and see some differences easily...The AKC standard does not have a size limit nor do they even mention temperament. http://www.akc.org/breeds/saint_bernard/
I'm sure if you look at each section you will find more.
Re: Difference between AKC and FCI standard?« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2007, 07:39:57 PM »
Thank you Lisa. Looking at them section by section my eyes seem to glaze over. I'm not a dog expert and the technical terms for the canine anatomy leave me boggled. I will tackle this slowly.
In the meantime, if anyone already is well-versed in this topic and can give me a brief summary of the main differences I would be very thankful.
Thanks for pointing out the temperment difference Lisa. Weak or aggressive temperments are considered eliminating faults for the FCI. That's got to be good!
In the meantime, if anyone already is well-versed in this topic and can give me a brief summary of the main differences I would be very thankful.
Thanks for pointing out the temperment difference Lisa. Weak or aggressive temperments are considered eliminating faults for the FCI. That's got to be good!
Re: Difference between AKC and FCI standard?« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2007, 11:05:43 PM »
This is tough because really this is like comparing apples to oranges. The FCI is an organization with very different goals than the AKC.
Because FCI rules and regulations are designed to improve individual breeds and to safeguard them from exploitation by humans, its standards often read very differently from the AKC which have no such rules or regulations. The AKC is not about "quality" at all in dogs, it is a sports registry only and a multiple breeds registry. The FCI however provides single breed registries, focusing on each breed.
Although the FCI is not perfect, if you can find a reputable breeder that adheres to the FCI, this would be your optimal choice. Please keep in mind however that breeding standards and FCI adherence resides with each member country - so as you would expect, some countries have better standards and safeguards than others. For example, Switzerland and Germany have poor standards whereas the scandinavian countries have great standards for breeders.
with Gracie and Skylar
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Re: Difference between AKC and FCI standard?« Reply #4 on: February 14, 2007, 03:54:48 PM »
Ok, I contacted one of the information folks at the Saint Club of America and this is what she wrote me:
Basically, the FCI standard requires that the dogs get their height from their legs; in other words they do not want big bodied dogs on short legs. Our standard calls for a 50/50 relationship between body depth and leg length while theirs is more 45/55. We all like our Saints to have good leg length and there are many dogs in this country that fail to meet even the 50/50 ratio and that is just not right. It was put quite well once when someone said a Saint should remind you or a horse, not a cow! So, any dog with a body depth (measured from the top of the wither, right behind where the neck blends into the back, to the bottom of the chest wall) that equals the leg length (measured from the elbow to the bottom of the foot while standing) is in good proportion for the AKC standard and will appear to be a tall dog. The problem that we see with many FCI dogs is that they are so leggy that they have lost the “powerful and imposing” look and take on the characteristic s of a Great Dane instead. Also, a good Saint should be “square”, in other words, he should be as tall from the withers to the ground as he is long from the front of his chest to the last boney projection of his rump. Too many of our dogs, both AKC and FCI are too long and it throws off the proper proportions. One of the other differences deals with eye color, we call for dark brown only and they allow lighter brown. This is no big deal as it is not something that will affect the soundness and health of the dog. I haven’t had the two standards side-by-side for comparison for some time, but don’t really remember anything else that significantly changes the dogs. Many US dogs are imported to Europe and South America because they found they need the bulkiness they have lost in their long pursuit of height. As this trend continues, the two styles of Saint will come even closer. To sum it up: AKC dogs need more leg length and shorter bodies; FCI dogs need more bulk and soundness. When I see the European Saints, I think of a 7-year old girl walking in her mother’s high heeled shoes; too many of them are spindly, lack power and have poor movement
So I am content.
I've got a bit of context in language that I can understand!! Very nice folks there at that club. 
Basically, the FCI standard requires that the dogs get their height from their legs; in other words they do not want big bodied dogs on short legs. Our standard calls for a 50/50 relationship between body depth and leg length while theirs is more 45/55. We all like our Saints to have good leg length and there are many dogs in this country that fail to meet even the 50/50 ratio and that is just not right. It was put quite well once when someone said a Saint should remind you or a horse, not a cow! So, any dog with a body depth (measured from the top of the wither, right behind where the neck blends into the back, to the bottom of the chest wall) that equals the leg length (measured from the elbow to the bottom of the foot while standing) is in good proportion for the AKC standard and will appear to be a tall dog. The problem that we see with many FCI dogs is that they are so leggy that they have lost the “powerful and imposing” look and take on the characteristic s of a Great Dane instead. Also, a good Saint should be “square”, in other words, he should be as tall from the withers to the ground as he is long from the front of his chest to the last boney projection of his rump. Too many of our dogs, both AKC and FCI are too long and it throws off the proper proportions. One of the other differences deals with eye color, we call for dark brown only and they allow lighter brown. This is no big deal as it is not something that will affect the soundness and health of the dog. I haven’t had the two standards side-by-side for comparison for some time, but don’t really remember anything else that significantly changes the dogs. Many US dogs are imported to Europe and South America because they found they need the bulkiness they have lost in their long pursuit of height. As this trend continues, the two styles of Saint will come even closer. To sum it up: AKC dogs need more leg length and shorter bodies; FCI dogs need more bulk and soundness. When I see the European Saints, I think of a 7-year old girl walking in her mother’s high heeled shoes; too many of them are spindly, lack power and have poor movement
So I am content.
I've got a bit of context in language that I can understand!! Very nice folks there at that club.
Re: Difference between AKC and FCI standard?« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2007, 03:26:29 PM »
Great...glad that helped.
All of the large and giant working dog clubs are very concerned about how "leggy" these dogs are becoming. Berners, Newfs, Saints all have a tendency in poor breedings to be leggy and lack bone. Sufficient bone is important to be functional and fulfill the purpose.
Good luck.
with Gracie and Skylar
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