Author Topic: *NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?  (Read 3849 times)

Offline schelmischekitty

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*NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?
« on: September 09, 2007, 07:51:10 pm »
this week started a new "phase" in my oldest son's...  development.  since going to the park and playing with all sorts of new kids, he's started biting.  out of anger, apparently.  the boys share a room b/c quite bluntly our house has 3 bedrooms and in the next week or so maya will be here and i don't trust in their judgement to behave well enough for one of them to A) share a room WITH her, or B) be in her room and not destroy everything since they SO love to rip, shred, paint, etc with whatever and on whatever they can b/c they get bored in the first 5-10 minutes it takes them to fall asleep.  right now, though, i'm seriously contemplating moving all her furniture into another room. somewhere i just don't know where! 

aiden has bitten tristan twice now.  this second time for no reason, other than i told him to "back out of my face some."  he really loves to get nose to nose with you all the time, and i just can't handle that.  i hate it.  with a passion.  i like my personal bubble and bluntly he's going to have to learn about bubbles eventually anyways, why not now.  they went to play with their toys, and tristan came out from playing with aiden with blood quite literally dripping down his back.  it's awful.  it really looks like hannibal lector tried to eat him.  i don't know what to do.  aiden never does it until THE second i turn my back to make lunch, or go potty or something.  just a second.  i can't watch them 24/7.  it's humanly impossible to watch thing one and thing two all the time.  you just can't, and trust me i've tried to the point of making myself so tired i couldn't even manage the energy to get up to answer the door. 

the first time this happened was b/c i asked them to go into their room while i went potty.  to explain, they can't be left alone for more than a second to start with b/c they just destroy everything.  they're very mischievous little boys.  tristan takes the kitchen and pulls everything out of the cabinets and off the counters, aiden takes the living room and the kitchen counters.  this happens most every time i've tried to leave them unattended for whatever reason.  i've tried everything i know and unless there's a second person there it just doesn't work.  i've even tried telling them to sit on the couch and i'll be right back, go on the stairs where they can't see me and watch them.  5 minutes later, they're still there not a peep.  10 minutes, nothing.  ok, i can go up and go potty now.  yeah, right.  i get back down and my whole house is destroyed.  from top to bottom.  anywho, when i got done going potty i told them to come on and tristan once again had blood on his back.

i know it's normal for him to feel jealous, and upset / angry over a new baby, but it's now causing my youngest son physical damage.  i know already he'll not be allowed alone around the baby, neither of them would anyways, but this just solidifies the "AT ALL."  someone please help me!  aiden was doing so well for the longest time and was behaving nicely, but now it's like he's possessed.  i know all kids typically go through a biting stage, but do they do it this hard??

modified to add that when i ask aiden why he did it, he says that "tristan kicked him" but i don't know whether or not to believe it, because aiden will tell you tristan hurt him to try to put the blame on tristan.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2007, 07:54:07 pm by schelmischekitty »
steffanie in atlanta

aiden (4), tristan (2), & maya (born sept. 17th)
axle-140ish-lb akita (4)
peanut-5lb, 11 months chihuahua
[img width= height= alt=Image Hosted by ImageShack.us]http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/3339/alltogethernowme6.jpg[/img]

Nicole

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Re: *NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2007, 07:58:09 pm »
Steff,
Wow. You have your hands full and I don't know what to say other than you need to get this situation under control before you have a baby there! I mean, seriously! Find a child therapist. Your boys CAN'T behave that way. What will you do when they're tearing your house apart and you have a baby on your hip? What if they bite the baby?

I don't know. I guess this isn't good advice. But, what's going on there isn't normal and I think you need an expert.

Offline schelmischekitty

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Re: *NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2007, 08:05:04 pm »
i'm seriously considering a therapist.  for them AND me.  they were doing SO well until i got to the point where i'm really uncomfortable (my hip / back is killing me because of the extra weight not to mention me getting sick) and the second they seemed to tune into that it all went downhill.  fast.  like within the past week or week and a half.  i know they're taking advantage of me, i've debated asking hubby if he'll go ahead and take leave now (and just tell work that i'm sick or something) because when he's here they're fine.  no problems all weekend, but today it started again.  it's really bothering me, typically they KNOW not to push me, but with me not being able to discipline like normal they're testing and on the verge of a flat up victory.

p.s.-  you'd have been amazed.  this weekend it was "yes ma'am" "no ma'am" and the same with "sir."  even from our 2 y/o.  hubby thinks i'm over exaggerating, which is pretty typical of him.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2007, 08:06:30 pm by schelmischekitty »
steffanie in atlanta

aiden (4), tristan (2), & maya (born sept. 17th)
axle-140ish-lb akita (4)
peanut-5lb, 11 months chihuahua
[img width= height= alt=Image Hosted by ImageShack.us]http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/3339/alltogethernowme6.jpg[/img]

Nicole

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Re: *NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2007, 08:06:13 pm »
Oh, I would DEFINITELY get a therapist for yourself, hon!

Pretty soon, your hormones are going to be so insane, you never know what you'll do.

Offline schelmischekitty

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Re: *NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2007, 08:09:49 pm »
i'm not so much worried about the hormones as i am about the vibes i'll be sending to maya (since i'm going to *try* to breast feed).  not to mention when i stress i get heartburn so bad it makes me vomit, and then that starts the chain of me feeling bad and then eventually i end up physically sick and in bed.  mom will be here, though, and she's big on discipline and well behaved kids, so it'll be easier for at least a week or two.  :(  but then, i'll have two weeks after she leaves and i'll be in the hospital again and it'll all start over only without her help.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2007, 08:10:57 pm by schelmischekitty »
steffanie in atlanta

aiden (4), tristan (2), & maya (born sept. 17th)
axle-140ish-lb akita (4)
peanut-5lb, 11 months chihuahua
[img width= height= alt=Image Hosted by ImageShack.us]http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/3339/alltogethernowme6.jpg[/img]

mama23+pyrs2

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Re: *NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2007, 08:14:46 pm »
Wow. Well, if I were you I'd have an email into Nanny 911, seriously! Just for the sheer fact they tear up your house to that degree, they are just completely out of control. Are they just bored? What about some activity they can get engrossed in, anything? There's no reason you shouldn't be able to leave the room to use the bathroom and trust them to behave at that age.

The biting is completely normal, as vicious as it sounds to other people and as terrible as it looks. I don't mean to say it's appropriate but a ton of kids go through it for one reason or another. I can tell you that I'm battling the biting issue right now as well. Elsha is 16 mos old and awhile ago started biting when she would get angry. Usually it was directed as me, at least she would attempt it but I would stop her in time, she will try to bite the Dr. because she doesn't want him touching her. But, she is a baby, she is upset and she has no way of telling me just yet. Jude went through a period when he was small of head butting and just throwing himself onto the floor- fitting. He never bit, and Elsha doesn't do the other things, they are all differnt. My firstborn never did any of those things at all!

Well, Elsha has started to bite Jude recently- he is 3. She gets mad if he is doing something she doesn't want him doing, or he doesn't give her HIS cup, whatever..and she bites him NASTY too and leaves a huge gash in the shape of her mouth on him. Well, of course he screams and cries cause it hurts, but NOW he has started to bite her back, ugh. So far I've found one nasty bite on Elsha that I can still see after 2 weeks. He has bite marks on his back from her that still haven't healed. I was telling my friend the other day, I was glad they didn't have well checks coming up soon or how weird would that look!

I don't know what to do exactly. Jude KNOWS not to bite, he is old enough and he never did that kind of thing before so I think it is purely revenge in his case. Elsha on the other hand doesn't 'get it' yet. When she gets mad and goes for me, I've started to tap her lips and tell her NO BITING! Anytime she's bitten Jude, I'm usually in the other room and catch it after the fact.

This is an article I found for 3-4 yr biting problems, maybe it will help you: 

http://parentcenter.babycenter.com/0_biting-why-it-happens-and-what-to-do-about-it_65493.pc

There is another one for smaller kids that I am going to read now for myself!

Offline navarre1316

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Re: *NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2007, 08:19:39 pm »
Have you talked to them about why you don't feel good?  I know they're young, but when kids get uncomfortable or nervous they act out.  And since they have been acting out since you started to not feel well, maybe they are nervous about that.  How structured is their time?  Someone said something about Nanny 911 and the one thing I always see her talk about is structure.  I hope things get better for you, take a lot of deep breaths!!

God placed me on this earth to accomplish certain tasks...I'm so far behind I'll never die!!

Navarre: GSD 9/13/99-5/14/06 patiently waiting
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mama23+pyrs2

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Re: *NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2007, 08:33:49 pm »
Have you talked to them about why you don't feel good?  I know they're young, but when kids get uncomfortable or nervous they act out.  And since they have been acting out since you started to not feel well, maybe they are nervous about that.  How structured is their time?  Someone said something about Nanny 911 and the one thing I always see her talk about is structure.  I hope things get better for you, take a lot of deep breaths!!



Good point. Are they on a set schedule so they know what to expect out of their day? I'm sure the baby coming is part of it but I'm sure that's not all of it. Jude was 21 mos old when Elsha was born and I never experienced him acting out or a thing during my pg with her or even after she was home. And he never got the whole baby coming thing either, he was too young. But, every childs personality is of course different and how they react to different situations.
Being a lot older now with this new baby coming, he is still doing really well with it, only he gets it now and is excited. Elsha is the one in the clouds this time around but I haven't noticed any change in her yet either. I'm sure that will change when she sees another creature here. ;)

Are there things they like to do a lot that they don't do often? Something they can focus their energy into. Jude loves to color but he will only color for so long. He isn't allowed to play with playdoh often so when I bring that out, he's into that for HOURS. Of course outside time to run out all of that energy would be a plus. Ours don't get that because well, it's SO hot (I'm sure it is there too) and we have nothing in the yard for them to do..working on that. Maybe you can take them for walks or something? Most kids love going for walks and looking at things and stuff, plus that would be really good for you with the baby so close to coming. But again, it's just so hot, I've gotta start walking in the early evening when it's cooled down a degree and isn't dark yet.

And also don't forget, the stress you are under NOW is affecting Maya, if not moreso because she is getting your stress hormones pumped directly into her bloodstream. It's sooooooo important you take time EACH day to take deep breaths, relax and send that baby some good and positive vibes. It's really important for you both, even if it's a hot bath when the kids are in bed or doing something relaxing and stress free during nap time etc.. I've been more stressed in this pg than I have in any other and I'm well aware when I feel it's an unhealthy stress and have to MAKE myself calm down and take it easy. Easier said than done, I know.

Offline schelmischekitty

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Re: *NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2007, 09:01:05 pm »
ok, i had answers to everybody but then i hit the "x" instead of the minimize button to check who said something lol. 

i know biting is norm to an extent, but i do know the blood thing is pushing it.  aiden is leaving marks two to two and a half fingers of my fingers wide (mind you i have small hands and my wedding ring is a size 6 1/2 and i have a 5 5/8" wrist) on tristan's back and they're black and bruised and bleed for a few minutes when aiden does it.  i just don't know how to stop it or what to do about it since he only does it when he KNOWS i have my back turned.

tina, i'm in no way offended by you mentioning that.  that's why i brought it up b/c i needed advice!  (btw, hubby is on my last nerve with the downplaying what i tell him!)

tristan did go through his biting stage while we were in ms, but has since stopped 100%.  with aiden, it didn't really start up again until aiden started going to the park though i KNOW no kids are biting him.  maybe it just over stimulates him to go, and i should limit it?

we do have schedule.  a very strict schedule.  it's not that that's what i wanted, but our kids are very set and the slightest changes effect aiden horrendously and tristan does well on it also.  aiden is very much the child you have to limit on mental stimulation b/c he doesn't know how to react and will spazz out if he has too much going on at once.  we do everything the same time every day, and if we have to go to a dr's appt. or something i tell them the morning before and remind them periodically so aiden can prepare for that.  he DOES understand there's a baby coming and "seems" happy about it being a girl and keeps saying he wants to meet maya. 

they do get their activities every day.  aiden's favorite is listening to classical music and "reading" his book or magazine and asking questions about what is that or what is this.  tristan HATES that part of the day but is decently quiet, so it does help for about 45 minutes.  aiden spazzes out with too much noise and tristan just can't be quiet for long.  they have their toys, and watch very limited tv.  they have park time, but too much time at the park with new kids over stimulates aiden and makes life horrible the rest of the day.  tristan, things couldn't phase him less.  they also have "dad" time where they rough house and play, etc. 

i have explained to aiden and tristan that there's a baby coming and that's why i don't feel good.  aiden has always been very clingy and needy with me.  maybe that's why he's behaving so badly (acting out) because he's used to sitting on me, propping up on my side (which hurts horrendously now b/c he uses his elbow), etc?  he's very intuned to his environment and even just slight changes can and will upset him.  tristan is somewhat oblivious, though i know he knows i'm pregnant.  he's a very mellow child, and nothing much phases him.

stress is awful.  i'm going through a pack of rolaids a day trying to keep from getting heart burn too badly (which starts a big cycle of making me vomit which makes me feel worst and i don't want to eat which makes me sicker, etc etc etc) i get from trying to deal with all the mess of everything going on.  i get it so badly if i wait too long between heart burn medicine that my whole neck, chest, and stomach hurt. 

at nap time i try to take a nap to "relax" and then the kids are going to bed at their normal time so then i light a candle and take a bath, but it is being brought up that i should try to avoid "warm" (i like them super hot) baths.  not to mention 9 times out of 10 i fall asleep in the bathtub completely unintentionall y.

thanks for the article, i'm going to go read it now!  any other advice is greatly appreciated.  like i said, you won't offend me, after all i'm asking for your help.  we're going to seek professional help (not only with the biting etc but also with how to better help aiden cope), i'm going to start making calls today to get him an appt.

« Last Edit: September 09, 2007, 09:03:00 pm by schelmischekitty »
steffanie in atlanta

aiden (4), tristan (2), & maya (born sept. 17th)
axle-140ish-lb akita (4)
peanut-5lb, 11 months chihuahua
[img width= height= alt=Image Hosted by ImageShack.us]http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/3339/alltogethernowme6.jpg[/img]

mama23+pyrs2

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Re: *NDR* kids, anger, biting and... blood?
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2007, 09:10:46 pm »
ok, i had answers to everybody but then i hit the "x" instead of the minimize button to check who said something lol. 

i know biting is norm to an extent, but i do know the blood thing is pushing it.  aiden is leaving marks two to two and a half fingers of my fingers wide (mind you i have small hands and my wedding ring is a size 6 1/2 and i have a 5 5/8" wrist) on tristan's back and they're black and bruised and bleed for a few minutes when aiden does it.  i just don't know how to stop it or what to do about it since he only does it when he KNOWS i have my back turned.

tina, i'm in no way offended by you mentioning that.  that's why i brought it up b/c i needed advice!  (btw, hubby is on my last nerve with the downplaying what i tell him!)

tristan did go through his biting stage while we were in ms, but has since stopped 100%.  with aiden, it didn't really start up again until aiden started going to the park though i KNOW no kids are biting him.  maybe it just over stimulates him to go, and i should limit it?

we do have schedule.  a very strict schedule.  it's not that that's what i wanted, but our kids are very set and the slightest changes effect aiden horrendously and tristan does well on it also.  aiden is very much the child you have to limit on mental stimulation b/c he doesn't know how to react and will spazz out if he has too much going on at once.  we do everything the same time every day, and if we have to go to a dr's appt. or something i tell them the morning before and remind them periodically so aiden can prepare for that.  he DOES understand there's a baby coming and "seems" happy about it being a girl and keeps saying he wants to meet maya. 

they do get their activities every day.  aiden's favorite is listening to classical music and "reading" his book or magazine and asking questions about what is that or what is this.  tristan HATES that part of the day but is decently quiet, so it does help for about 45 minutes.  aiden spazzes out with too much noise and tristan just can't be quiet for long.  they have their toys, and watch very limited tv.  they have park time, but too much time at the park with new kids over stimulates aiden and makes life horrible the rest of the day.  tristan, things couldn't phase him less.  they also have "dad" time where they rough house and play, etc. 

i have explained to aiden and tristan that there's a baby coming and that's why i don't feel good.  aiden has always been very clingy and needy with me.  maybe that's why he's behaving so badly (acting out) because he's used to sitting on me, propping up on my side (which hurts horrendously now b/c he uses his elbow), etc?  he's very intuned to his environment and even just slight changes can and will upset him.  tristan is somewhat oblivious, though i know he knows i'm pregnant.  he's a very mellow child, and nothing much phases him.

stress is awful.  i'm going through a pack of rolaids a day trying to keep from getting heart burn too badly (which starts a big cycle of making me vomit which makes me feel worst and i don't want to eat which makes me sicker, etc etc etc) i get from trying to deal with all the mess of everything going on.  i get it so badly if i wait too long between heart burn medicine that my whole neck, chest, and stomach hurt. 

at nap time i try to take a nap to "relax" and then the kids are going to bed at their normal time so then i light a candle and take a bath, but it is being brought up that i should try to avoid "warm" (i like them super hot) baths.  not to mention 9 times out of 10 i fall asleep in the bathtub completely unintentionall y.

thanks for the article, i'm going to go read it now!  any other advice is greatly appreciated.  like i said, you won't offend me, after all i'm asking for your help.  we're going to seek professional help (not only with the biting etc but also with how to better help aiden cope), i'm going to start making calls today to get him an appt.



yeah I like super hot baths too and am always bummed I can't take them while I'm pg. Doesn't mean they need to be lukewam or anything though. This is what I found:

as long as the water temperature isn't over 100 degrees Fahrenheit. If you have to ease your foot into the tub, it's too hot. If you're comfortable getting into the water, the temperature is close to your own body temperature, which is where you want it. Anything hotter can damage your baby's developing cells, and though you can cool off by sweating, your baby can't.
If the water is too hot, you get overheated and that increases your heart rate, reduces blood flow to the fetus, and potentially puts the baby under stress.

I still take hot baths during pg, just not as hot as I used to, and when I can feel myself getting too hot, I get out.
I'm glad you're looking into getting some help. :)