difference in guarding behavior

[pyr4me]

My mom came to visit this past weekend. She has been here one other time since I adopted Jenny, the last time I had only had Jenny about 2 months and everything was fine. My mom came in and Jenny walked right up to her for pets, etc.

This time whenever my mom walked in the door, Jenny would run up and bark intensely at her. When I told Jenny it was ok, she was fine and then was back to letting my mom pet her.

So I'm wondering if I am correct in my thinking about this...it seems to me that perhaps now that Jenny has been here almost 6 months that she has settled into her "territory" and now feels the need to alert me to an "intruder" and to guard and protect her territory and flock, as Pyrs are bred to do. Is there something that I should be doing to address this? Or do I just need to make sure that she responds to my telling her it's ok when someone comes over?

[GreatPyr]

Personally I would not discourage this behaviour,even if you could,may not be able to...as long as she is ok when you want her to be or tell her to be.

Go Jenny!

[pyr4me]

When I told Jenny it was ok, she was fine and then was back to letting my mom pet her.

If you have welcomed your mother into your home or any guest for that matter, Jenny doesn't have to be all lovey dovey but she shouldn't be barking in their face or at them.

Well, I hadn't quite "welcomed" my mom into my home the first time, she just kinda walked in the front door, as she usually does. And then when we went out and came back in the house, it wasn't exactly like she'd been welcomed in again per se, she just came in with the rest of us. Clearly I need to think more about how people come in the house...this is the first time Jenny has responded this way and Tipper welcomes everyone in, being the Golden mix that he is, so this is new to me. (as you can also tell, we don't have guests over very often...)

[GreatPyr]

IMO as long as she is accepting mom or anyone else in once you say so then i would say she is just doing what she is suppose to do,a Golden is a Golden and a pyr will act as a pyr

I had a dobie that was shown and well well socialized and I had to put him out when company came that he had never seen before,he was at home and it was his job to guard everything.

Bear will greet,bark,sit and watch everyone that comes into the house,I do not correct him,its his job..if he was trying to snap,bite..etc that would be different.

[Pyr Heaven]

I sort of agree with Great Pyr. Since Jenny doesn't really know your mom, and she just walked in the house without you letting her in, it's understandable that Jenny acted the way she did. She was alerting you to let you know, "Um, mom some strange woman just let herself in our house!!!" She was also alerting the "intruder" that, "hey, this is my house and I didn't say you could come in. Stay back!" I think the main thing is, that once you told Jenny it was ok, she calmed down. That's very important.

Now, if your mom was a regular at the house, I'm assuming Jenny would not do this. If she did, that is something I would not allow, since she would be fairly familiar with her. Also, if your mom knocked on the door, and you went to greet her at the door, and Jenny still acted that way, I would not allow that either.

[BigSoftandFluffyLover]

I agree.  My boy does the same thing.  He barkes and get in whoever's face but his tail is up and wagging through the whole thing.  So, i think that its kind of HEY IM HERE, DONT MESS WITH ME!!  BUT I LOVE YOU!!!!! PET ME!!!!  Thats my two cents.

[marypyrs]

I completely agree with Julie.

link=topic=22264.msg271794#msg271794 date=1205769622]
 
I would not react this way, you are in fact reinforcing her behavior by saying "it's ok" and coddling her. I would definitely correct it. If you have welcomed your mother into your home or any guest for that matter, Jenny doesn't have to be all lovey dovey but she shouldn't be barking in their face or at them. I would definitely correct the behavior and not let it be acceptable. I would probably put Jenny in a sit if you can when your mom enters, let your mom have a super yummy treat to give her and don't let her give it to Jenny till Jenny has behaved how she should.

Good luck!

Julie

You don't want to have an "Attack" / "Guard Dog". You want a Pyr. There's no excuse for bad behavior in any dog. And 'if needed' a well trained and socialize Pyr will know when such behavior is appropriate. Chances are that she'll never need to display it.

The wag of an upright tail does not necessarily mean that they are a happy dog. It can be a warning sign, in fact.

To condone and reinforce such reactions could be a real problem in the future.

This is something that would also be nonacceptable if she were ever to attempt completion of her CGC and/or Therapy Training.

Jenny is a wonderful, beautiful, and exceptional girl in every way. She has a wonderful Mom and a wonderful home. Don't let anyone talk you into something that might just backfire. 

Jane

[jennifer]

This is an interesting post and I'm happy to share my two bits.  My saints are both door protective... they bark at knocks, the doorbell, shouts at the door, and they're alert to the sound of the screen door opening.  I've had to really work with them regarding when to be protective and when to let down.  Bear has to 'lie down' when welcoming guests as he starting nipping at elbows in a 'not really hurtful but definitely aggressive' way.  Nakita will take my lead but still barks for awhile when a new guest arrives -- mostly out of excitement I think but maybe also some anxiety.  Having new guests give a yummy treat is a winner, especially with Bear, who can be a little nervous but is fantastically food motivated.  They both have to sit and be quiet to receive the treat.

In my experience, it's best to be in charge and clear about expectations at the door and with guests.  And it doesn't take much to do it.  Good luck and keep us posted!

[pyr4me]

In my experience, it's best to be in charge and clear about expectations at the door and with guests.  

Yes, obviously this is what I need to do--be very clear with Jenny about when people enter the house, although she did stop as soon as I told her to. It surprised me that she acted that way as she hasn't in the past, even when the window guy came in. She was curious, but not barking, which is her usual way of being when there's a knock at the door, etc. She doesn't act too excited, hyper, jumpy or otherwise obnoxious at the door or when people enter, except for this recent barking at my mom. Although now that I have been thinking about it more today, I was upstairs when my mom first entered the house and my daughters were downstairs--but when we came in together later during the weekend, then I was there when we all came in. Maybe Jenny reacted that way the first time because I wasn't right there and she was trying to determine things herself, particularly with my girls there.

My mom lives in another state from me and comes for weekend visits every couple of months, so she's not anyone that Jenny is really familiar with.

You've all definitely given me lots to think about and to pay attention to with Jenny. Thanks for all of the advice everyone!

[GreatPyr]

IMO as long as she is accepting mom or anyone else in once you say so then i would say she is just doing what she is suppose to do,a Golden is a Golden and a pyr will act as a pyr

Greatpyr, I know your are h*ll bent on thinking a pyr is 100% different from every other breed in that they HAVE to guard ALL the time and do what they HAVE to do but I just completely disagree. If the dog (ANY breed) is in your home, under your roof and trained by you, you should be able to tell them when someone is allowed in your home.

Now that I know pyr4me didn't introduce her to Jenny, it makes sense that she was a little on guard. BUT if she walked right in with everyone, that should have also been a sign that hmmm she might be new but she's with mom (pyr4me) so I'll follow her lead. I definitely think at that point Jenny's mom should have introduced her mother to Jenny to really settle any kind of worry Jenny might have had but that didn't happen this time.

Pyr4me, I am sure with a little guidance, Jenny will be great with your mom and anyone else that you welcome into your home! 

Not H%ll bent on anything other then read up on your pyrs then,they are different then most breeds,they have an ancient Guarding instinct bred into them.Besdies the pyr thing,Jeny barking at mom at the door is not unusual at all in a dog period...I said if she had growled or tried to snap then theres a problem,but to bark and let her know someones just entered the house is being a plan good watch/guard dog or whatever you would like to call it.I would not expect any different especially from a PYR.

[GreatPyr]

I think this has gotten way off base here,She didnt growl, or attempt to bite the mother, she got up and barked...I find that completley normal in any dog.And if a Pyr DOESNT bark at a stranger I would fine THAT odd.

[People Whisperer]

I think this has gotten way off base here,She didnt growl, or attempt to bite the mother, she got up and barked...I find that completley normal in any dog.And if a Pyr DOESNT bark at a stranger I would fine THAT odd.

It was her MOTHER and not a stranger! That's exactly the point we are trying to make

[GreatPyr]

But I thought she said her mother doesnt visit that often,so basically a stranger to her(the dog)??

[GreatPyr]

Went back and reread,Jenny has met her mom once,so IMO still stranger.

[marypyrs]

Not H%ll bent on anything other then read up on your pyrs then,they are different then most breeds,they have an ancient Guarding instinct bred into them.Besdies the pyr thing,Jeny barking at mom at the door is not unusual at all in a dog period...I said if she had growled or tried to snap then theres a problem,but to bark and let her know someones just entered the house is being a plan good watch/guard dog or whatever you would like to call it.I would not expect any different especially from a PYR.
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While I'm sure you are well-intentioned, GrPyr, I must caution you to air on the side of caution in your expectations of the Pyrenees and socialization of the same. A "small amount" of knowledge can be a very dangerous thing. Reading articles over a few months does not qualify a person's expertise.

I know you love your Babe. He's a darling boy. But I question what your end goal will be.

I have taken in many "rescues" over the years who required more work and socialization than you could ever believe. All because their "People" thought it would be cool to have a guard/attack dog. It backfired. In this day and age - there is NO need for such a thing. AND in this day and age, there is no more need for that than having a loaded gun in the house. (IMHO)