So how did you do it.......... ?

[Sam]

We are very lucky to have Sam as being a part of our family.
Sam, when being with me, is an excellent, example, and perfect dog when one on one with me alone. I just have to whisper a command and Sam will obey. But when other family members are around, like our son and my wife, Sam seems to forget all the training and discipline we both went through, the last couple of months. Sam thinks that i am the mubero uno in the pack, and that he is numbero two. My wife and son should become first. what did i do wrong ? Should i involve my wife and son into the training of our puppy dog Sam ? If so, please give us some deatailed advice so we can try and tell you about the results. Our Sam is half Turkish shepherd and half great pyrenee. 11 months old now and not nutered yet.  

[LaurieW]

You will definitely want to have your wife & son start training Sam...he sounds like a good dog, just mixed up as to his place in the pack.

[GYPSY JAZMINE]

I have two G. Pyrs...Samson turned 1 last month & Pippin is 6 months...Even my 2 children ages almsot 7 & 8 are their superior "dogs" in their minds...It wasn't always that way with Sam at all!...He had his mouth on the kids constantly & would not mind them at all!...Then we went to puppy classes & I learned how to make the kids higher status "dogs"...Let your wife & kids feed the dog...Have them keep the food up until your dog sits...Same as going outside which is a privlege, the dog must sit before he goes out & don't ever let him go out or come ion a door before any of you do!...No treats before the dog sits...No privleges at all before the dog sits....This establishes a pecking order...In our house nothing comes free...Our dogs always have to sit before they get anything...My 6 yr. old daughter at 52 lbs. can run my dogs around like no ones business!...I actaully have to send her into the yard to bring them in when they won't come for me!...lol....I would strongly advise obidience classes attended by the whole family & also do an internet search for Suzanne Clothier & read!...Good luck!~

[Sam]

Thank you LaurieW, Sam is indeed a very good dog and he is willing to learn. I can see his smile, everytime i go and get him for another walk or just to play with him. ( Sam is an outside dog for the summer, and has his own dog house outside). He gets so excited, everytime we are taking him off his outside leash, just to walk with him, that he hurts my son or my wife with his nails or play biting theeths. I am the only one that can take him of his leash without getting hurt. and sometimes, i have to discipline him, before i can leash unleash him. He gets so excited. but i do understand why. He is on a leah the whole day, outside, until we come home. So he is happy to see us all. I cannot blame Sam, but it has become to a point that my wife and son does not show much interest in Sam anymore, because he is just to wild to handle for them. I can handle him. dont matter how big he is and gets. But for my wife and son, the scratches and play bites are to much, they cannot stand up to Sam. They do not have the physical power or strenght. Now i told them, it is not about your power or strenght, it is all about the way you present yourself in front of the dog. Your posture, your voice, your actions, your moves, your body language and your brains. Just stay calm and give Sam no attention when he runs up to you to jump you........... ....... stick out your knees if you want to, to avoid the jump. Make Sam know that you do not appreciate what he is doing. Hurt him, i know, sounds bad, but only once, if you can, just to let him know that he cannot do this again. So he will understand that his actions will have results he wont like, painful ones. But, it does not help, although, Sam is getting a bit better with my son. Which i am involving, my son, in every minute, which i spend with Sam, for a week or so now.
 

[Sam]

Thank you  GYPSY JAZMINE, i will for sure try to find something from Suzanne Clothier and read it. In the meanwhile, i do involve my son with everything,  right now,  that has to deal with Sam.  And i see that my son, as well as Sam is inproving.  Sam still like to chase my son, and try to impress him, scare him, but i noticed that when our son is trying to stand tall, and not to give into Sam, and not try to protect himself from Sams jumps, he is victorious over Sam and Sam backs off.
 

[GrumpyBunny]

OK, don't yell at me, but I have a couple questions.....  Is Sam outside just for the summer, and will be a "house dog" in the winter?  Is there any way to get him a little bit more integrated into the family? 

I am just asking cause if he is a mix of "guardian" breeds it might be very hard for him to be away from his "flock", which is you guys.  And I think you are right - I think he is so overwhelmingly excited to see you guys after being outside all day, that he can not control himself when he does get to.  And the less your wife and kids interact with him, the worse it will be when they do try to.  But he needs to learn the rules for proper interaction with them.

Is there a reason that he is not neutered?  You may find that would help with some of his issues going forward....

I understand if you have reasons that you don't want him in the house, or don't want to neuter him - I am not judging, just trying to understand the situation.  It really sounds like Sam is eager to please, and he is just frustrated and over-excited right now, and trying to figure out who is "boss of him" and who he is "boss of"....

[GYPSY JAZMINE]

Thank you  GYPSY JAZMINE, i will for sure try to find something from Suzanne Clothier and read it. In the meanwhile, i do involve my son with everything,  right now,  that has to deal with Sam.  And i see that my son, as well as Sam is inproving.  Sam still like to chase my son, and try to impress him, scare him, but i noticed that when our son is trying to stand tall, and not to give into Sam, and not try to protect himself from Sams jumps, he is victorious over Sam and Sam backs off.
 

YW!...& that is exactly right about your son!...Not only did I teach my chidren to hold their ground when Sam tried to mess with them but I actually told them to advance on him & keep coming at him until he retreated!...I have used the "alpha roll" on occasion & it really works!...My skin kids are too small to roll the dogs though so I allow them to advance on the dog & shove at them & advance & shove until the dogs back off...My kids will not retreat for a moment until the dogs are "in their place"...Of coarse this is only put into play when the dogs (Sam for the biggest part) try to bully the kids by running at them, mouthing them, jumping on them, etc...B.t.w., it is in the Great Pyr's nature to bond to & obey the one person of their choice...tradi tionally they are livestock gaurdians & "back in the day" there was one shepard to bond to & obey...Also Pyrs are dogs who think independantly as they were often left alone to gaurd the sheep for days at a time & had to make independent descisions.

[Sam]

I am not going to yell at you. I need your advice. I learn from people like you. I know were you getting at, good question. When we first got Sam, he was an inside dog, we tried to keep him inside. For weeks. Although, we knew, that the previous owners kept him outside day and night. Ever since they got him.
Me and my wife tought that that was kind of cruel for a puppy, so we kept Sam inide for about a month. After ripping and totally destroying most of our furniture, we decided to give it a try, we managed to get  Sam a large dog house and we kept Sam inside until it was bed time. When bedtime arrived, i would walk Sam to his outside doghouse, in our backyard, and leah him up to a chain, long enough to get into his dog house and wonder far beyond his dog house.  This turned out really well, Sam did not cry or bark at all. I will tell you that there were times, late at night, that Sam woke me up, i fell asleep, just to take him outside and leash him up in front of his dog house, outside. in the back, because he probably could not stand the heat in the house. He liked it outside.
All i am trying to say is that he prefers to sleep outside. But to answer your next question, NO, Sam is not going to be outside during the winter. He will be inside during the winter. That is why i am so curious and desperate to get Sam trained before the cold weather arrives. He will be with us, inside, during those cold winter nights. There is NO way i would let him out there by himself in the cold. 

Another question, Sam will be nutered. But right now, we do not have the money for this. I am a salesman. And the holiday season, November and December, is when i earn the most money. so Sam is going to be nutered in November for sure. And i hope that this will make it easier for Sam,  my wife and son.

Right now, i am the one, that spends the most time with Sam, i do so anytime i come home from work. My wife and son tried, to do the same thing, but they just dont have the power and strenght to deal with Sam. I am lucky that i do have the power and strenght to do so. Sam is very attached to me and he thinks that i am Alpha. My looks and body language will make Sam understand what is going on. It is amazing. Sam is like wax in my hands.  I just hope that one day, my wife and son can handle Sam the same way as i do right now. without any major hassles and injuries

[Sam]

Our son, recently is picking up the power of standing his grounds. Not to make a move when Sam comes up and  running to charge him. And it works.  The less our son pays attention to Sams charges, the less Sam is trying to repeat his moves. Our son is noticing this change and he likes it and takes full adventage of it. But, probably, like every child does, he likes to take advantage of this and he starts to challenge Sam. Which i dont mind, because it is a good test for Sam. Upto now, it is going really well. We had a backlash,  week or two ago, when our son was trying to keep Sam from eating the cat food. Sam warned our son in a really nasty way to back off. This shocked me. He growled at our son and did a fake attack. He did not bite but he growled really nasty and did a fake attempt to bite our son and showed his theeth really nasty.
From that moment on, i let our son feed Sam. This was two weeks ago. Soon, i will let my son, under supervision, feed Sam, as usual, and let our son interrupt Sam, while he is eating, and let our son touch the food Sam is eating.  Someone on this board told me that this was the right thing to do in a situation like this. And it makes sense. BTW, you are so right about the Great Pyrs being so independent, that is probably what is making them so smart at the same time.  And what is making them excellent outside dogs. The thing is that our Sam is a cross breed of a Turkish shepherd and a Great Pyrenees, which makes him a bit differens from the pure breed pyrenees. But makes him twice the guard and watch dog i realised

[GYPSY JAZMINE]

Our son, recently is picking up the power of standing his grounds. Not to make a move when Sam comes up and  running to charge him. And it works.  The less our son pays attention to Sams charges, the less Sam is trying to repeat his moves. Our son is noticing this change and he likes it and takes full adventage of it. But, probably, like every child does, he likes to take advantage of this and he starts to challenge Sam. Which i dont mind, because it is a good test for Sam. Upto now, it is going really well. We had a backlash,  week or two ago, when our son was trying to keep Sam from eating the cat food. Sam warned our son in a really nasty way to back off. This shocked me. He growled at our son and did a fake attack. He did not bite but he growled really nasty and did a fake attempt to bite our son and showed his theeth really nasty.
From that moment on, i let our son feed Sam. This was two weeks ago. Soon, i will let my son, under supervision, feed Sam, as usual, and let our son interrupt Sam, while he is eating, and let our son touch the food Sam is eating.  Someone on this board told me that this was the right thing to do in a situation like this. And it makes sense. BTW, you are so right about the Great Pyrs being so independent, that is probably what is making them so smart at the same time.  And what is making them excellent outside dogs. The thing is that our Sam is a cross breed of a Turkish shepherd and a Great Pyrenees, which makes him a bit differens from the pure breed pyrenees. But makes him twice the guard and watch dog i realised

I don't know a thing about Turkish Shepherds....W ill you tell me about them?

[LaurieW]

The books I found most helpful when I got Miko as a puppy 13 years ago were the ones by the Monks of New Skete.  They raise German Shepherds, but their methods are good for all breeds of dogs.  They had videos at the time, as well as books....you might start there?

I think a crate inside is a good idea.  Sam needs to know where his space is.

It sounds like you are on the right track with having your son help, but your wife needs to do the same things, or she will be terrified of the dog & the dog will know it & take advantage of her.

Good Luck!

[Sam]

The Anatolian Shepherd Dog, also called the Karabash, is a large, noble and powerful livestock guardian. This is an ancient breed native to Asia Minor. It is also known as the Turkish Guard Dog where he protects flocks and serves as a shepherd's companion. On the high Anatolian Plateau, where summers are hot and very dry and winters are cold, the Anatolian Shepherd Dogs live outside all year round. He is very similar to the Great Pyrenees and the Kuvasz, but is more slender and agile. Capable of great speed and endurance. The Anatolian Shepherd is a very loyal, alert and possessive dog. It is intelligent and easy to train, but is not a dog for beginners. It needs a handler who naturally radiates leadership. Calm, steadfast and brave, but not aggressive. Independent, very watchful, proud and self-assured. Affectionate with their own family, but suspicious of strangers, especially after reaching adulthood. Strangers should be formally introduced before the mature dog is asked to accept them. The Anatolian Shepherd is possessive with respect to its home and property and will not allow anyone into the family property if the owner is not home, unless it has had frequent contact with the person, but he is fairly friendly with those people the family accepts. The dog is demanding of itself, and can be stubborn and dominant.

[GYPSY JAZMINE]

The Anatolian Shepherd Dog, also called the Karabash, is a large, noble and powerful livestock guardian. This is an ancient breed native to Asia Minor. It is also known as the Turkish Guard Dog where he protects flocks and serves as a shepherd's companion. On the high Anatolian Plateau, where summers are hot and very dry and winters are cold, the Anatolian Shepherd Dogs live outside all year round. He is very similar to the Great Pyrenees and the Kuvasz, but is more slender and agile. Capable of great speed and endurance. The Anatolian Shepherd is a very loyal, alert and possessive dog. It is intelligent and easy to train, but is not a dog for beginners. It needs a handler who naturally radiates leadership. Calm, steadfast and brave, but not aggressive. Independent, very watchful, proud and self-assured. Affectionate with their own family, but suspicious of strangers, especially after reaching adulthood. Strangers should be formally introduced before the mature dog is asked to accept them. The Anatolian Shepherd is possessive with respect to its home and property and will not allow anyone into the family property if the owner is not home, unless it has had frequent contact with the person, but he is fairly friendly with those people the family accepts. The dog is demanding of itself, and can be stubborn and dominant.

AH-HA!...I am somewhat familiar with the Anatolian Shepherd! I have come across documantation of it many times in my G. Pyr research...It was one of the gaurdian breeds I was very intrigued with!...Ty!...Woohoo!...That'd be one headstrong dog you have!

[tanimara]

Hi,  Jackie Wood here.  Tanimara Great Pyrenees.  I wanted to put my two cents worth in here...

You have received some very good advice so far.  I only want to say a couple of things.. first of all, obedience class is a must.  This dog will tend to be a little more human agressive than a full blooded Pyr.  Anatolians tend to be that way over all.  But for the most part, the overall temperament of the Pyr (except for human agression) is about the same.

With 20 years experience with Pyrs and some with Anatolians, I can tell you that the advise for you to get this dog in obedience class is a must.  The longer you wait, the more problems you will have with him.  I know it's hard when money's tight but if you dont get this under control right away, you are going to end up with a dog that you can not live with.  The same with having him neutered.  Neutering will help with the aggression some but not fully.  So if you have to set priorities due to finances, I would recommend you get him to obedience classes first then have him neutered ASAP.  These obedience classes need to be a family thing as recommended.  It's even more important that your wife and child attend than yourself.  You sound like you have a fairly good handle on things but apparently not your wife and not your son yet.

2nd... get him off that chain ASAP.  A dog on a chain is a bored dog and a bored dog is a disctructive dog.

I also want to address this statement by a very dear friend of mine.. dont kick me Chelle..lol  "B.t.w., it is in the Great Pyr's nature to bond to & obey the one person of their choice..." Not a correct statement.  Pyrs love their families as do Anatolians, but they are very adaptable (unlike a chow for instance) to new situations and new people.  They are not a one person dog.  I think this misunderstandi ng comes from the fact that they are very territorial and protective of anyone or any animal in that territory once they accept them as theirs.

Also, a good explaination of integrating a dog into your family and helping the dog to find the proper place in that pecking order of your "pack" is found here...

http://sonic.net/~cdlcruz/GPCC/library/alpha.htm

Hope this helps,
Jackie

[lins_saving_grace]

Jackie,  your puppy is so cute.  looks like the puppy on the Puppy Chow bag!