Author Topic: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!  (Read 41080 times)

Offline Carolyn

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #15 on: December 11, 2005, 02:33:56 pm »
Personally I would make an agreement that if it didn't work out you MUST be notified before any decissions were made. In my contract from Apaches breeder it states that the puppy/dog must not be surrendered to any shelter, the breeder must be notified first.
Good luck what ever you decide.
Carolyn
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Icerotti

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #16 on: December 11, 2005, 02:37:53 pm »
The policeman may not realize that Petra is unstable, or he may think that such a dog is okay for protection work.  I don't know.  If you do decide to go ahead, please talk to him, and make sure he understands that a protection dog is not just supposed to be aggressive; they must be extremely obedient and be good with children, or they will hurt someone badly.

Good Hope  I understand what you are saying and it is correct.  Protection dogs do need to be stable. I was thinking that if they are real professional police dog trainers. They may be able to figure what is triggering Petra. If it is something that can not  be correctable than there may be no options left for her.  I do think that it is important for Petras mom to make sure everyone in the situation is fully aware of her problems, which she seems very willing to do
edit =spelling
« Last Edit: December 11, 2005, 02:41:24 pm by Icerotti »

Offline Nina

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #17 on: December 11, 2005, 03:05:37 pm »

I do agree with everyone that you should call this guy and talk to him, and maybe ask him if you can talk to the trainers as well and give them all the specifics and see what they have to say. This may sound corney, but I believe that things happen for a reason, fate if you will maybe she is suppose to go to this police officer or maybe this was suppose to happen so that you could talk to your vet about the drug that Jeanne mentioned. No matter what you decide we are behind you 100%



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Offline BabsT

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #18 on: December 11, 2005, 03:14:36 pm »
Your dog has weak nerves and has proven several times to be unstable....I am sorry the last thing that is going to happen for this dog is to become a certified dog in protection.  Your dog is a liability and a big one at that.  I am sorry, I am not sugar coating it....How many people has your dog bitten now?  I know you love your dog but sometimes love isnt enough.  Your dog is still young and caused a lot of damage maturity isnt going to help her and just make her instincts stronger.  How many Neo's has this trainer trained?  They arent like herders or other molossers...th ey work mainly in defense and your dogs defense is infact fear which isnt correct for a Neo or any other breed for that matter.

These people may not have children but the neighbor may or realitives may and what good is a protection dog if she has to be confined.  Training a dog for guarding is a very fine and delicate line and takes many many years.

There are so many dogs that dont make the cut in that field that were bred from titled parents and dont work out.

Am my deepest apologies if this comes across to harsh..I am hormonal due to being pregnant but I feel that this dog is dangerous and has shown a trememdous amounts of signs as truly being a fear agressive powerful animals
« Last Edit: December 11, 2005, 03:30:51 pm by BabsT »
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Offline jabear

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #19 on: December 11, 2005, 03:40:27 pm »
I'd say give it a shot. Maybe someone else can get through to her and help her to become a productive member of the dog community.  :)
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Jaime
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lins_saving_grace

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #20 on: December 11, 2005, 03:43:08 pm »
definately!  It's worth a shot.  She just hasn't found her niche yet!  This may be it.

Offline BabsT

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #21 on: December 11, 2005, 03:50:17 pm »
Have any of you taken in a dog that is unstable that has been from unstable background? 

You cant even beging to work a Neo in protection until 18mths to 2 years because they are all defense driven

Ground work is started with tug and lots and lots of handling before all of this

I personally know professional decoys and have had long conversations with situations with this

This dog wont even let her nails be clipped never mind taking the pressure of a stick or a decoy charging at her with a hose full of water
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lins_saving_grace

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #22 on: December 11, 2005, 03:51:15 pm »
Have any of you taken in a dog that is unstable that has been from unstable background? 

You cant even beging to work a Neo in protection until 18mths to 2 years because they are all defense driven

Ground work is started with tug and lots and lots of handling before all of this

I personally know professional decoys and have had long conversations with situations with this

This dog wont even let her nails be clipped never mind taking the pressure of a stick or a decoy charging at her with a hose full of water
Yes I have taken in a rescue that was "unstable".  she turned out to be the best dog I ever had. 

Icerotti

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #23 on: December 11, 2005, 03:51:23 pm »
Our Katie girl(rotti) was such a handful once she started to mature, growling snapping, nipping etc.. I had been to different trainers, nothing was helping. I think my vet had reservations about her. I found one last trainer, if it were not for him. We probably would have had her put to sleep. He got this dog into shape, like you would not believe. No it did not happen overnight. It took time and patience. We saw gradual changes over time. She became a very loving and great family pet. She spent the last 5 years of her life with my daughter with no incidents at all. This trainer trained police dogs and bomb dogs. His dad was a trainer and he grew up with learning training from his dad. He is an amazing trainer and made all the difference in her behaviour. Even our vet at the time comment on the change. He said I would have never believed it, if I didn't see it for myself. She was a real lil bugger to our vet.  ;) Some trainers can make all the differnce in the world.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2005, 03:53:44 pm by Icerotti »

Offline BabsT

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #24 on: December 11, 2005, 03:54:44 pm »
I think the difference is that you had a dog with stable nerves just very dominant and challenged once starting to mature which can 100% be worked...Petra has been abused and has gone past biting and growling....an d a rotti is different than a Neo

You cant give a dog a stable temp...the dog has to has to be born with it.  This dog is acting this way long before maturity is setting in
« Last Edit: December 11, 2005, 03:57:45 pm by BabsT »
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Icerotti

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2005, 03:58:31 pm »
I think the difference is that you had a dog with stable nerves just very dominant which can 100% be worked...Petra has been abused and has gone past biting and growling....an d a rotti is different than a Neo

Very true BabsT.  I guess I just hate to see this situation and am grasping for an alternative, although there may not be another one.

lins_saving_grace

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2005, 03:59:07 pm »
I think the difference is that you had a dog with stable nerves just very dominant which can 100% be worked...Petra has been abused and has gone past biting and growling....an d a rotti is different than a Neo
Mine may not have been a Neo...but she was abused. 
And this guy can make his own decision. 
I understand your point of view...really I do.  But this guy must know what he's getting into and how to do what he plans on doing.
This has got to be a hard enough decision for Smohr...let's not bicker about this please?

Offline Good Hope

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2005, 04:00:29 pm »
Good Hope  I understand what you are saying and it is correct.  Protection dogs do need to be stable. I was thinking that if they are real professional police dog trainers. They may be able to figure what is triggering Petra. If it is something that can not  be correctable than there may be no options left for her.  I do think that it is important for Petras mom to make sure everyone in the situation is fully aware of her problems, which she seems very willing to do
edit =spelling

My point is this: I'm afraid that this policeman might not know what he is doing if he is considering taking a dog that has a history such as Petra's.  If he does know what he is doing, there is no harm done; either it will work out (extremely unlikely, IMO), or he will tell you that he cannot keep her.

Basically, I think it is a very bad idea; I agree with BabsT about this.

Consider this: If this man does not know what he is doing, how would you or this man live with it if she hurt or killed someone?  There is a very real potential for that.

I know I am trying to talk you out of this, and I may come across as very harsh, but I think you need to hear what I perceive to be the truth about Petra.  As sad as it is, some dogs cannot be helped.  Abuse may have been the problem or may have had nothing to do with this; it could be genetic, in which case there is nothing you can do.  You have done everything you possibly can to save this dog, but she has not improved.  The bottom line is: Petra remains unstable and therefore dangerous.

Sofia and Deena

P.S. My mother (Deena) says you deserve a BPO award for patience.

P.P.S. Just to clear up any confusion, Mother usually posts here.  If the post is signed Sofia, I posted.  Mother usually signs (not always), in which case the post would be signed with her name.  :)

Offline mastiffmommy

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2005, 04:01:44 pm »
Sherry, this has to be sooo hard for you. You asked for advice and I guess since this is such a hard hard situation we all see it from different aspects. First off I want to say, no matter what any of us think, YOU are the one who makes the dec. about what is going to happen to petra.

Someone mentioned Amitriptylene, that is actually a meds. for people with depression. I have heard of it being used for dogs, but dont have any experience of that myself. If that is something you have not tried, maybe that would be something to look into.

We all have different opinions in this, and since it is such a terrible situation for you Sherry, I cant even imagine having to be in that one. I want you to know that whatever you decide, we are behind you, YOU are the one knowing Petra and after collecting facts about the training and the trainers, maybe, hopefully you can come to a conclusion that feels okay in both head and heart. Meanwhile we are here to support you, NOT to point fingers, no need to pour salt in wound.

Hugs

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Offline BabsT

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Re: ADVICE @ PETRA??? HELP!
« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2005, 04:03:52 pm »
 I was in shock tonight when she grabbed me and bit my hand as I was feeding her.  She continued to growl and snap at me.  Earlier, she had lunged at my adult daughter, bit her on the back of her leg and then was growling at the grandchildren

This dog is a HUGE LIABILITY and a very DANGEROUS dog....People are giving her false hopes...yes the dog will be out of her hands but in someone elses

When do you consider a dog dangerous to society?????

« Last Edit: December 11, 2005, 04:05:35 pm by BabsT »
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