Author Topic: talked with the breeder...  (Read 10253 times)

Offline lulu

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talked with the breeder...
« on: January 17, 2006, 03:34:29 pm »
okay, so i just talked to the breeder on the phone for the first time (we had been communicating via email). everything she said sounded good. she doesnt even require a deposit to reserve the pup i want. i just have to pay by the time the pup is 7 weeks old. i picked one out that i want but she said as the weeks go by and i see all the pics that i can switch to a different pup if i want to and if another one is available. which is good even though i am pretty sure i will stick with the one i already picked. she has a one year guarantee on the hips. and the parents have health clearances. and the pups will come with AKC papers. the only thing she did say which made me wonder is that she doesnt x-ray the puppys hips. does that sound right to you all? i dont really know much about it, this is my first time buying from a breeder so i want to be careful. i figure it is okay since the pups come with the 1 year hip guarantee but i want to be sure. everything else sounded great and i am all kinds of excited about bringing my pup home in 7 weeks!!! she also said that if at anytime i decide i dont want the dog anymore that instead of taking it to a shelter i can bring it back to her. which sounded good to me bcos she apparently really cares about the dogs and isnt just trying to make a quick buck. so thats good to know.

Offline Anky

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2006, 03:38:31 pm »
OK Run away far and fast.  Hips can't even be checked till the dog is two so a 1 year guarantee is worthless.  If she knows anything about Saints she should know this, so either she's trying to pull one over on you, or she's naive, and honestly, for your first time, you want an experienced breeder.  Just my opinion.  A dog with health issues can because very expensive very fast.

Edited to Add:  When you say health clearances, what do you mean?  Just that a vet said that they were healthy?  This is unacceptable, you need heart, and thyroid and eye test done.  Do more research on Saints, find out what genetic issues they're supsceptible to, and make sure that the parents were tested for them, and passed!  AKC papers also don't mean that the dog is quality.  All it means is that it's registered with the American Kennel Club, meaning the Club knows it exists.  If the dog is on full registration (Which No first time owner should EVER have, again, in my opinion) then they can be shown and that they're offspring can be registered as well with the AKC.  Limited registration means that the dog's offspring can not be registered, and this is done to discourage dogs from being bred that aren't up to standard. 
« Last Edit: January 17, 2006, 03:46:36 pm by Anky »
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lins_saving_grace

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2006, 03:44:56 pm »
No kidding.  I wouldn't like that breeder.  Call another one...find another one.  The last thing you need is a breeder with dogs with bad hips.  Look into the breed with the AKC and find out what requirements a breeder has to meet with hips and certifications .  see if you can find out how long they have been breeding pups, etc.  look them up with the BBB.  All that stuff.   sounds like this breeder may be a backyard breeder and won't be able to provide you papers and pedigree info. 
When I got Grace I got the papers a few weeks later in the mail and once I registered her I got an "official" pedigree tree.  I also got that from the breeder even though I didn't buy Grace's pedigree for breeding.  I have a limited registration instead.  We signed a contract and everything.
Ask her about the pedigree!  Ask her about the hip and elbow certifications .  Get a book from the library or the pet store about Saints and find out what you need to ask a potential breeder you plan to buy a puppy from.   This one sounds like a bad one.
"A dog with health issues can because very expensive very fast"  <---especially a big dog.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2006, 03:45:50 pm by lins_saving_grace »

Offline renate1

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2006, 03:48:25 pm »
do you mind sharing the breeder?  Sounds like the lady I got my last female from in June of 2005.  If so I can give you a "hands on" reference.  So far I've been extremely happy.  Please inform of the breeder and I will let you know if it is the same one.

Offline newflvr

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2006, 03:49:01 pm »
Yep....gotta agree with Anky.  It's okay that the puppy's hips aren't xrayed...as Anky said, they can't be checked until the pup is 24 months. The big question is are the parent's hips OFA checked?  What about all the other health clearances?  You can check on the breeder's health histories at the OFA website www.offa.org).  If she is not getting those clearances, you should be very, very worried.  There is nothing more heart breaking than losing a puppy to a disease that could have been stopped through proper breeding.   All these giants have health issues and it is in your best interest to find the very best breeder that you can.  Interview several breeders and compare notes.  The most expensive pup may be the cheapest down the road if he/she remains healthy and conversely, the cheapest puppy can be incredibley expensive with vet bills.

Good luck!!!  This is a fun process if you LOVE learning about PUPPIES~~~ ;D ;D ;D ;D

Offline Anky

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2006, 03:52:46 pm »
do you mind sharing the breeder?  Sounds like the lady I got my last female from in June of 2005.  If so I can give you a "hands on" reference.  So far I've been extremely happy.  Please inform of the breeder and I will let you know if it is the same one.

No offense, and I'm not trying to start anything, but if you got this dog in 2005, and it IS the same breeder, your dog isn't even a year old yet, and their hips can't be checked either. 
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lins_saving_grace

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2006, 03:57:50 pm »
How much does she want for a puppy?  With limited registration?  Or are you buying the pedigree for breeding?

Remember...you get what you pay for.

Offline renate1

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #7 on: January 17, 2006, 04:00:55 pm »
I know there hips can't be checked yet.  But so far I am please with this dog.  I have had Saints ever since I was a child.  I know a good dog when I have one....I have had some that I have not been happy with(physically and tempermant speaking).  I study this breed extensively.  I was just stating that the pup I have is a wonderful dog, the breeder has kept in great contact/communication.  As stated I am aware hips can't be certified until 2yrs, but I would be very surprised if this dog would end up having problems.  I take no offense at your comment but I do think we can sometimes be a little quick to judge people.  Not all "backyard breeders" are evil.  There are those that care deeply about there dogs, know the breed, study the breed, love the breed and there are those "reputable breeders" that  are only in it for the buck.  I think to catergorize someone without knowing them is unacceptable.. .along the same lines as being a racist or sexist. 

Offline Anky

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2006, 04:10:47 pm »
Not all "backyard breeders" are evil.  There are those that care deeply about there dogs, know the breed, study the breed, love the breed and there are those "reputable breeders" that  are only in it for the buck.  I think to catergorize someone without knowing them is unacceptable.. .along the same lines as being a racist or sexist. 

I totally agree with you.  I work in rescue and have met some very sweet wonderful BYBers.  However, I stand by the fact that in the long run they are doing a disservice to the breed they love.  I think that a dog needs to prove its self worthy of being bred.  Be it in the conformation ring or as a working dog.  Temperament in and of itself is not enough.  Someone once told me breeding is a 3 legged stool.  Conformation, Temperament and Health.  If one leg is short, the stool isn't stable.  If people just breed their dogs because they love them, or they think they're pretty, or they're so sweet and everyone just wants a puppy, eventually the dogs will look and act nothing like they're supposed to.

I work with Great Danes, and so many pure bred AKC papered Danes look like nothing more than giant labs.  Nothing wrong with them and they are equal in worth to the top 20 Danes in the country in my opinion, however, if it were not for the ethical breeders who keep a tight reign on the dogs they use, and make sure that the dogs prove themselves in all areas, eventually the Dane that we know would be gone, leaving behind it giant leggy dogs bearing no resemblance to the regality we revere them for. 

I think that education is very important.  Most people looking for a pet puppy wouldn't think to look for a show dog, or a working dog breeder.  The want a pet so they go to a pet breeder.  If someone doesn't know the testing to look for, they can be sucked into a heart breaking process of a dog they love and adore dying or becoming crippled before their very eyes. 

And in reference to the hips, I still say that a 1 year guarantee is worthless, and it is a warning sign.  Not saying that this is a horrible money hunger puppy dealer, just a something to look out for. 

Thank you for understanding.  :)

Edited for my spelling errors and clarification on my part.   :-\
« Last Edit: January 17, 2006, 04:13:09 pm by Anky »
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lins_saving_grace

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2006, 04:12:12 pm »
well let us know what you find out and how you feel when you get closer to taking your pup home. 

Offline lulu

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2006, 04:14:18 pm »
 thanks for all your comments so far. i would be getting the pup from a woman named vicki in missouri. her website is **************  apparently the pups parents are not ofa certified but she told me that she has had the mothers line for 11 years and have always had healthy pups. she wants $850 for the pup. it will just be a pet, not a show dog. i really appreicate all your comments. i am relatively new to saints and i dont want to end up with one with health problems.
   
« Last Edit: January 17, 2006, 05:17:34 pm by Jacksmom »

Offline Anky

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2006, 04:15:50 pm »
Hmmm I can't seem to find that site.
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Offline lulu

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2006, 04:17:06 pm »
 also i forgot to add the the pups father is a show dog. i dont know if that matters or not...

Offline renate1

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #13 on: January 17, 2006, 04:20:41 pm »
I totally agree with you on all the counts you stated.  I see alot of "Saints" that look nothing like the breed, that is so sad to me.  I also see alot of people breeding for size only....which in my humble opinion has alot to do with hip/elbow problems.  I know how my joints feel/perform when I have excess weight on them!  ;D 

I also agree the one year hip guarantee is worthless, but the breeder I got my pup from which I'm thinking now is not the same, did not specify a date on hips etc.  They had the one year guarantee on other genetic problems.  But were also willing to take the dog back at anytime (which is nice but not useful to me...once you have the dog I consider it family and would not return for any reason). 

Thanks for your reply again I was not offended but just like everyone else....had my own opinion. ::)

Offline renate1

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Re: talked with the breeder...
« Reply #14 on: January 17, 2006, 04:22:03 pm »
Nope not the same breeder.  Have seen that website before though.  Sorry can't be of any help.